Class Ballance.

[TOMMYskillfiger]

 

7 hours ago, Spawn said:

In server description cleary say what Aelf is weak in pvp, I too want all classes to be same in pvp but we have it,its admin judges.

Vrf have low pvmDsr and mb he can beat u on BC or rabbits coz they don't have a lot Dsr, but on medusa/selupan and mb kundun Vrf have low DPS. MB if admin will rise dsr on Bc statues that will be resolve situation.

Mate, u don't play here first day, u know de rules, descriptions and if u make Arf u understand her strong and weak parts. Rf can easy make rebuild if something going wrong and make Vrf but elf don't have same possibilities 

 

P.S. next please

im just waching someone defending his class with cheap comments.

we are at 15rr rf yet hasnt double dmg from ml and his dmg will raise more and more cuz of the formula %. If  paper ae cant win even in a pure pvm fight like bc statue and im talking with pure pvm stats no vit no ene only str/agi imagine what will happen on bosses later on where survivability matters too.

now answer me whats the point to play ae if she loose even on pvm and his pvp possibilities is till mid game. Atleast make her pvp char or pvm top like it was advertised.

dont be greedy you cant have everything with one build especially when its that easy to build and play that class.the only class which position doesnt matter

[Phantomel]

8 minutes ago, TOMMYskillfiger said:

 

im just waching someone defending his class with cheap comments.

we are at 15rr rf yet hasnt double dmg from ml and his dmg will raise more and more cuz of the formula %. If  paper ae cant win even in a pure pvm fight like bc statue and im talking with pure pvm stats no vit no ene only str/agi imagine what will happen on bosses later on where survivability matters too.

now answer me whats the point to play ae if she loose even on pvm and his pvp possibilities is till mid game. Atleast make her pvp char or pvm top like it was advertised.

dont be greedy you cant have everything with one build especially when its that easy to build and play that class.the only class which position doesnt matter

I still see that the vast majority of elves are still dominating world events(Cursed/Kundun/BQ and so on). You have to take into account that the characters that you compare yourself to might be much more higher in terms of ML than yourself, thus having a huge advantage. RF HAS double damage on master skill tree. Elves were top hunters and dominated every BC till now(I don't even want to speak about 3-4 reset twinks stealing the statues solo against 4-5higher rr parties). Your pvp possibilities aren't till mid game, as ice arrow has a HUGE impact in the game. Maybe in the future you guys will be able to use your buffs outside CS and it will be an advantage for you. But compared to other classes that did nothing till this point of the game, you can't cry and expect to be top pvp, lol. I'm pretty sure that around 8-9 resets elves were unkillable in pvp. Huge defense cause they were spending everything in AGI and huge burst damage.

[TOMMYskillfiger]

isnt that abvious that ae should win any pure pvm fight while she get so low def and hp from vit? in my point of view ae with pure pvm stats should be able to be contested in a pure pvm fight only from pvm smg/ arf(since his aoe side isnt that good like emg)and pure pvm summ or even emg idc but to be able to have 50k hp and winning a pure pvm fight imagine what advantage is this in pvp boss fight. Anyway im just expressing my opinion admin and his team can check for himself and see whats better for his server.

[Phantomel]

Lets put it this way - You have 2 days worth of time to check all announces and take screenshots. We'll count how many of them are taken by RF or any other class(Besides DL - cause it really has a problem right now, and it's dominating both PVP and PVM - most probably due to the fact that they die really hard and they have enough time to pump up damage). You will see that most of them are taken by elves and I can give you a few examples if you'd like. Elf is all about the positioning and staying as close as you can to your target to be able to pump damage to the fullest potential. The damage on statue in BC, as far as I know, is calculated for each party, and it's dying really fast. RF probably has high burst damage, but I don't think that right now it can compete with AE in high amounts of damage over time(sustained damage) If we compare same lvl/ml and W3 and item sets. Also, the point you're missing when you are saying that elf is useless in PvP is actually the most important. We all know that the key of staying alive - even in world pvp where more people focus you, is moving. What's the best counter to moving? Not Ice storm or any other slow which can be removed - It's ice arrow. 

Also, dont worry about low vit, you can always use an eBK and eRF to counter that ^^

[TOMMYskillfiger]

this game cant be fair cuz elfs maybe are more active. about bc i were in same party with those vrfs and i were checking their life aswell and they had tons of hp so not glass cannon and hadnt ml (double dmg yet) .about burst or dps could be possible if the statue were alive 5 sec max and about luck (more dd more crit/rate even with less crit rate than elves ) could be possible but not everytime. Now about boss fights slow from rf cant be removed as i know but its not the point when your role is to be the killer of the boss you ahve to hide and focus on boss not ice or slow,you got another ppl for that so dont forget that enemies can ice ae aswell.ill do some more tests on test srv and ill come with more complete idea about what we are talking. thanks for this discussion atleast you speak with arguements

 

[Phantomel]

The Ice arrow was purely a reply to you saying that she lost her pvp possibilities. And as I was saying, you have Senpai as an example of an elf that is doing pretty good in pure PVM environments, killing a lot of world bosses in the past days. You can't expect a class to dominate the server from 0 resets till the end game. Things change, as they should.

[Juri]

I think attack rate of chaotic for DL should be reduced, DL should be more of kiter - like when someone jumps to him he shouldn't be able to kill them so easy. More like hit people with horse, and kite with chaotic. Right now you just can stand, don't care about hitting horse and just chaotic anyone and kill them pretty easy.

So pretty much DL should be the best char for 1vs1 - maybe reduce delay on horse skill by one second(if possible, not sure if this depends on client anyhow), but reduce attack rate of chaotic? 

Only vRF with tons of hp stands any chance.

[Juri]

On 11/19/2020 at 2:02 AM, ADMIN said:

Those that depend on macros to play BK will never play it at its full potential, and if you as player can't pass a macro level on combo you shouldn't play BK at all.

What is actually a macro?

It is a registered sequence of keys pressed either by keyboard or mouse, or both, that goes on an repeat loop, based on the speed and etc. you initially set.

Why it sucks compared to *good* player skills?

• If you get "stucked" (which always happens on PvP, the moment your character stops from attacking by having a "hurt" animation) your macro will continue its sequence and combo will fail (as you are stucked, can't get out those skills) -> combo fails. If player skill is involved -> player does stop the combo sequence during the stuck moment and continue after it -> Combo succeeds.
• If you get stunned (by BK mace ML, sleep, ice arrow, etc.) your macro sequence will continue but your skills won't -> combo fails. If player skill is involved you can control it, either restart it if you don't have time or finish the remaining skills -> Combo succeeds.
• If you get "pushed" by either other skills (earthquake, lightning, other bk/mg weapon skills) or even by your own weapon skill (cyclone/etc.) - your character will move a bit before continuing the actions you put him to do - your macro sequence will continue but your skills won't -> combo fails. If player skill is involved, you can control it, same story.
• If you miss the cyclone skill (purely "MISS", due to ASR/DSR PvP) - your macro sequence will continue but combo won't work as 1st skill missed. If player skill is involved then you do another cyclone until you don't miss so your combo can work.

And so on, just the most important aspects where macro sucks, which are in most of cases. The only actual use for such macro where it does help is on PvM or stationary targets that doesn't attack back.

Especially for him, but for anyone that thinks he can beat good (even if rusty) BK skills with a "macro", and only with a macro. I don't neglect people's actual real skill on BK, as I know very few BKs, but for sure I know that any decent BK can beat a macro and I'm personally up to prove it anytime, and I'm sure Gion is up as well, not sure if Legion wants / have the time but he's another good BK I trust on the job.

Instead of having macro for COMBO, it's better to have macro for Q, Right Mouse Button and Ctrl key in one key, and you do combo by yourself, so you can time it right - because as you said stuns, ref, damage, etc things.

[Hvman]

On 11/19/2020 at 2:11 PM, Phantomel said:

So, if I understand this well, you want AE to be as strong as RF is in pvp. Let me remind you that until 15 resets the RF was a total joke. BK is the worst in PVM BY FAR and BK's still get their ass kicked in pvp by other classes somehow, due to our very low capacity to CC or gap close on them. Elf is supposed to be insane in PVM early/mid and mediocre in pvp(though I'm pretty sure elf kicks ass, and excepting DL they can still win vs other classes in pvp due to their insane burst). Will you guys do anything about destruction(higher slow chance)? And if you guys will not buff the bk in pvp(it's the only unchanged class since the start of the DB), can you at least buff a bit his pvm capabilities? I know bk isn't supposed to be a hunter/PvM char, but atm. bk is a huge joke, and we're forced to make alt chars for pvm purpose - I'd rather go hunt with my 6rr AE than with my main bk. Also if you don't have a premade group to carry your ass, Imperial event is just another event that us BK's don't have any chance of getting rewards from ranking, cause no one will take a BK in a timer run just to ruin it ^^. I know you guys like the ideea of missing one combo - lose pvp, and I understand that you are long time BK players, but compared to other classes who are ranged, have slow or higher movement speed and insane damage, BK is just a joke. As much as I love BK and the whole class fantasy thing(Tank character who likes to go toe to toe with foes) I'm really thinking of rerolling into something else.

 

Also, AE is said to have medium damage, but compared to other classes that have medium-high damage, or high burst damage as you said, I'm pretty sure AE dominates every world boss and events, and I think that anyone that is active on server can confirm - Also, I like the idea of starting to let the elves use their buffs outside of CS as well(weaker version)

You talking about AE vs Non DDI- Non w3 classes. Go Try AE vs ddi/w3 and you'll see they can't touch you, because no dmg, because they lose 4k ene, because they need to add more vit than the rest because their hp/1vit is low. Also i want to see that AE that's beating VRF on BC statue :)) You are funny. 

Also i did not say only about AE, i also said about bk, and all other classes BESIDES sm because i said i did not test it.

To answer your question or conclusion, no i dont want ae to be as strong as rf, i want to have a meaning besides ice arrowing. AE are no longer pvm top chars, because their HP POOL is very low, and easily killabie in BQ/Future GGD/Selu/Medusa, so no more rank1 top dmg from AE.

[Colossus]

What I see here ,is that you all complain about your characters .You all want your characters to be top in hunt,pvp ,pvm .Till now DL was OP ,now some1 was complaining about ELF being OP ,now another one said that VRF is OP ...wait till late game and see that fenrir will be OP ,but not for all ...and keep this topic to cry each rr.

[hellldrake]

having arguments about the current pvp and pvm and complaining is 2 different things,if u dont have anything constructive  to say dont say it.

[Phantomel]

1 hour ago, Hvman said:

You talking about AE vs Non DDI- Non w3 classes. Go Try AE vs ddi/w3 and you'll see they can't touch you, because no dmg, because they lose 4k ene, because they need to add more vit than the rest because their hp/1vit is low. Also i want to see that AE that's beating VRF on BC statue :)) You are funny. 

Also i did not say only about AE, i also said about bk, and all other classes BESIDES sm because i said i did not test it.

To answer your question or conclusion, no i dont want ae to be as strong as rf, i want to have a meaning besides ice arrowing. AE are no longer pvm top chars, because their HP POOL is very low, and easily killabie in BQ/Future GGD/Selu/Medusa, so no more rank1 top dmg from AE.

Time will tell ^^ I trust that the staff will take the right decisions in balancing all classes.

[zer0x1]

On 11/18/2020 at 4:07 PM, Hvman said:

I'm opening this topic maybe players have something in mind to ballance the classes even more that Admin will enjoy and implement.

My ideas are :

DL - Nerf his pvp dmg by 5%, add his PVM dmg 5%

AE - Boost his PVP dmg by 7 to 9% and/or make him get higher hp/1vit point.

EMG-Boost his pvp dmg if he's that low hp/def, by at least 8-9%

SMG- Increase his defens and/or hp/1vit point and lower his dmg by 3 to 5%

VRF- dunno, fix it, he's broken. 15rr has way better singletarget than ae, unkillable in pvp, tears through any sm/summ/mg/ae even BK easily. Can't kill DL cause DL is more broken atm XD.

BK - i think admin really likes BK to be OP as long as Zutto plays him XD I think he needs a bit of work, his def is low (we tested set+12 full ddi, w2+11) , maybe add 3-4% to his def, since the rest will be covered by w3.

Summ- I think summ is just fine as it is.

SM- Haven't tested it yet, i think his icestorm does a bit too much dmg(pvm), but just by seeing it, didn't have the chance to test it.

Feel free to come with different ideas, maybe they will be usefull.

DL - I completly disagree. SDL could use a PvP buff. PvE on the other side is way too strong (id even say REMOVE some PvE dmg)

AE - Is the best early game class spiking at 3-4rr and falling off later. Please don't buff the easiest class in the game

EMG - You're making a decision if you build EMG. Can't have it all when deciding to take the range and farm advantage. EMG is just fine in PvP if build properly

SMG - Is a glasscannon as it should be.

VRF - Whut? 

BK - Is the most balanced class regarding high combo hits in relation to agi/vit/survivability. Wouldn't change a thing

Sum - Too uninformed to give an oppinion

SM - Kinda Balanced, could maybe use 2-3% more pve dmg (arguable)

 

My summary:

Gotta say I disagree with most of what you said. Some points are decent tho

 

 

[Juri]

12 minutes ago, zer0x1 said:

DL - I completly disagree. SDL could use a PvP buff. PvE on the other side is way too strong (id even say REMOVE some PvE dmg)

AE - Is the best early game class spiking at 3-4rr and falling off later. Please don't buff the easiest class in the game

EMG - You're making a decision if you build EMG. Can't have it all when deciding to take the range and farm advantage. EMG is just fine in PvP if build properly

SMG - Is a glasscannon as it should be.

VRF - Whut? 

BK - Is the most balanced class regarding high combo hits in relation to agi/vit/survivability. Wouldn't change a thing

Sum - Too uninformed to give an oppinion

SM - Kinda Balanced, could maybe use 2-3% more pve dmg (arguable)

 

My summary:

Gotta say I disagree with most of what you said. Some points are decent tho

 

 

SDL could use a PVP buff? How is that? Pretty much only VRF can do anything against SDL, all other clases are rekt really fast, chaotic is hitting way too fast.

[Roby]

So everyone went to forum , made a nice ''description'' about how DL is OP and bla bla bla , so now what you think about RF ? That he s unkillable on 1v 1 , very hard to kill even on 2v1 . Try DL damage vs a char with a set with DDI , no so much there fellowz , so stop the drama , chars are well enough balanced , except VRF def . Have a nice evening

[TOMMYskillfiger]

15 hours ago, Roby said:

So everyone went to forum , made a nice ''description'' about how DL is OP and bla bla bla , so now what you think about RF ? That he s unkillable on 1v 1 , very hard to kill even on 2v1 . Try DL damage vs a char with a set with DDI , no so much there fellowz , so stop the drama , chars are well enough balanced , except VRF def . Have a nice evening

ofc you wont do that much dmg(at 15rr) to someone with ddi set cuz its too early for someone to have ddi set yet when youll get 5-10rr more youll do insane dmg to them too

[enTaroaduN]

15 hours ago, Roby said:

So everyone went to forum , made a nice ''description'' about how DL is OP and bla bla bla , so now what you think about RF ? That he s unkillable on 1v 1 , very hard to kill even on 2v1 . Try DL damage vs a char with a set with DDI , no so much there fellowz , so stop the drama , chars are well enough balanced , except VRF def . Have a nice evening

I guess everyone is complaining about DL class, but not the DL owners themselves. Let me put it this way so you can understand, most of you on this server, changed race into DL, and why is that? Because you knew the class is way beyond broken, why? Let's see why:

[PVM view] Just a few small examples:

-As some people said above, about VRF solo stealing bc statue from AE's, I saw a lot of solo DL's stealing bc statues from solo AE's as well, using Chaotic. And as for a small example here, I tested my friend's pure AE with full Aruan Set, decent Albatros Bow Lk+2% +11, w2 +9, 13rr against Nephilim's DL. The thing was, indeed Nephilim is 14rr, not a big difference for 1 rr, but still, I managed to get first to 2 +5 goldens in Reliks, Nephilim came after 10 seconds or so. You know what was the result? He took both goldens, even tho I was first there, even tho I managed to have dmg advantage before him, he purely melted their healths with Chaotic like my elf was nothing.

-Illusion Temple event, the thing is, DL is invincible since now, he can rebuild before the event starts. He just goes full tank and the other 5 people can't kill him, we can just wait till he delivers the Star, again and again, not to mention his mobility while using Horse. So the DL's always be the first to reach the Star and take it. So who gets the DL in their team, it's 100% win. And as a small reference about IT(The Illusion Temple system that's extremely unbalanced and it's about Master Level. When the event starts, it gives you 131,141,151lvl and so on, well, the thing is, the ones who have Master LVL, will automatically be detected as more lvl than the others that don't have ML. I had several times people with ML in IT 2-3-4, that we couldn't kill at all, just because they had this ML lvl difference. So tell me why people with ML are redirected to IT 1-2-3 where the newbies are trying to play and they will face top players with insane gears and master level that they will just can't be able to kill. This is extremely unbalanced and it ruins the event, completely.

-At this point, when almost nobody has fenrir, DL can just leave a dust trail behind everyone else that tries to hunt goldens, because of his Horse he can reach the goldens before any other class, he can cover the maps before any other class.

-I saw several times DL's that can steal Cursed, Kundun, Bloody Queen, goldens, from top AE's like HellDrake, Senpai, Dajbuzi. The reason is, in PVP invasions or the boss events, DL's can just resist till the end, spamming Chaotic on the boss while AE's can instantly die and lose the opportunity for more dmg on the boss. On the other side, on NON-PVP, again, DL's have more DPS on chaotic, than AE's on MultiShot with perfect positioning. BETLEY as a DL can confirm you all that he easily stole, several times, bosses from AE's, in PVP and NON-PVP.

-And a lot of other things that you all noticed but you don't want to mention them because most of you now, changed into DL race so you can abuse it's overwhelming power over other classes. I can't wait for DL nerf so you can all change your races back, and be as bad as you were in the early stage. You were an MG at first eRoby, now you changed to DL, and we both know why. And I agree with you about VRF, he is extremely strong as well and easy to play, but has extremely low mobility and some of his spells are not hitting at all on moving targets, you need to have nerves of steel to play VRF against other classes.

[PVP view] Just a few small examples:

-Chaotic range and dps, it's insane. It's impossible for other classes to kite that since it has instant dmg on the target even if the target it's moving, not to mention the insane dps and dmg, even tho the DL is Hybryd DL and not pure SDL. It can just melt your health from a range that you can't even reach with other classes. And I will give you examples for each class, except SUMM, EMG and ARF, cause I haven't tested it my self:

[DL]vs[BK]: Except CC and IT, anywhere else BK has no chance against DL, especially because of it's horse power. DL can infinitely kite BK and spam chaotic from insane range, and why except CC and IT? Because outside this 2 events, DL can instant use Horse Power if the BK manages to reach his position. So between this classes, at this point, it's a "catch me if you can" game. While BK can't even get close to hit a combo, DL can just kite, run and spam Chaotic till BK dies. Not to mention the Destruction skill for BK, is it even working? I tried several times, can't hit a single slow on the target, either has way too low hit rate, either not working at all.

[DL]vs[SMG]: The same story as DL vs BK. The small difference is that SMG can use ice to slow DL down, but again, pointless, cause if SMG reaches DL position, he can easily use Horse Skill or antidotes. And let's not talk about a DL with 2 +4 Ring of Ice ^^

[DL]vs[AE]: While AE, as people mentioned above, has to sacrifice some points from her pure AGI build for Ice Arrow and lot of VIT to have decent health, not to insta die from 1 single hit, DL doesn't even have to balance a build, it works either way, you can't even tell the difference between a Hybryd DL and SDL, they both have insane survivability, insane mobility, insane health, insane dmg, insane def, you name it. AE has to get extremely close to DL to even try to use Ice Arrow on him. DL against AE, doesn't even have to move anyway so consider him permanently Iced but he can still kill you from insane range, while you as AE, can't get close to him to hit your full DMG, so what's the point? I know AE it's not supposed to be that good in PVP, but why you should limit the classes only for a small part of the game? So AE from now on it's gonna be useless in PVM and PVP as well? So everyone gonna just change race from now on? And we will see only elfs for Ice Arrow at CS and some bosses? Feels extremely wrong to me. There are people who wants to enjoy their favorite classes till the end of the game, not only for a small number of resets, then to just feel forced to change the class into something else that has potential in the game so they can compete with others. That's not fair to be honest, DL was a top class since the db started, could easily compete against AE with Chaotic. So why a class should permanently be top class in early, mid and maybe in late as well? But on the other hand, some classes will just be useless.

[DL]vs[SM]: As a SM my self, I can tell that at this point, SM it's the most balanced class in the game, the scaling it's exactly as the Staff said it will be. The SM is getting stronger and stronger as it should, in a balanced way, but again, we have a problem against DL. The key point of SM in PVP it will always be the positioning and your kiting skills so against other classes, SM can kite, position and fight back as it should be. But, against a DL, positioning and kiting with teleport, it's pointless. He can just use F10 outzoom to it's maximum and spam chaotic from a range that none of your spells can reach. SM was supposed to be a range class, right? Yet none of it's spells can reach a DL position while he can spam Chaotic from that position, as a SM not even when you try to use Ice Storm to the nearest position of that DL, sometimes it won't reach at all, but DL's chaotic will reach you. And if you will try to get in his range to spam Blast, you will instantly die.

[DL]vs[VRF]: At this point, VRF it's the only class that can get close to fight back a DL but even like that if only the DL stays still and it's not trying to kite. Imagine both 14rr classes(RF and DL). The ammount of health VRF has, it's huge, right? Arround 40k even more with full +hp set, rings. Well, imagine all that HP just going down like ice melting, from a range that VRF can't reach if the DL is kiting. Even tho the DL won't kite, VRF will have no chance against him.

[DL]vs[SUMM]: I haven't tested this one my self, feel free to speak if anyone did. But in my opinion, since SUMM is such a squishy class, we know the story

[DL]vs[EMG]: Not tested, but as SUMM class is, this EMG build it's squishy and as well, so the same story I guess.

[DL]vs[ARF]: Not tested, and since ARF it's trash in PVP, not even worth to mention.

[DL]vs[DL]: Not tested, but I am actually curious about a fight between SDL and Hybryd DL, i wanna see who wins.

I could go on with several examples, but you all know that DL is extremely broken at the moment, even tho some of you won't admit it, because you are defending your own class, but still. Even tho ADMIN said that DL it's still extremely strong, compared to other classes. Somehow, some of you are here telling us the opposite. At this point, even the worst DL player on the server, can beat most of other good players, just because the class it's broken and doesn't require too much skill, if not, doesn't require skill at all, since all you have to do it's to stay stil and spam Chaotic.

I hope it isn't too much to read, you can call me Reporter ^^. But I tried to put some things together since everyone is leaving their opinions here, there it is mine.

[Juri]

10 minutes ago, enTaroaduN said:

I guess everyone is complaining about DL class, but not the DL owners themselves. Let me put it this way so you can understand, most of you on this server, changed race into DL, and why is that? Because you knew the class is way beyond broken, why? Let's see why:

[PVM view] Just a few small examples:

-As some people said above, about VRF solo stealing bc statue from AE's, I saw a lot of solo DL's stealing bc statues from solo AE's as well, using Chaotic. And as for a small example here, I tested my friend's pure AE with full Aruan Set, decent Albatros Bow Lk+2% +11, w2 +9, 13rr against Nephilim's DL. The thing was, indeed Nephilim is 14rr, not a big difference for 1 rr, but still, I managed to get first to 2 +5 goldens in Reliks, Nephilim came after 10 seconds or so. You know what was the result? He took both goldens, even tho I was first there, even tho I managed to have dmg advantage before him, he purely melted their healths with Chaotic like my elf was nothing.

-Illusion Temple event, the thing is, DL is invincible since now, he can rebuild before the event starts. He just goes full tank and the other 5 people can't kill him, we can just wait till he delivers the Star, again and again, not to mention his mobility while using Horse. So the DL's always be the first to reach the Star and take it. So who gets the DL in their team, it's 100% win. And as a small reference about IT(The Illusion Temple system that's extremely unbalanced and it's about Master Level. When the event starts, it gives you 131,141,151lvl and so on, well, the thing is, the ones who have Master LVL, will automatically be detected as more lvl than the others that don't have ML. I had several times people with ML in IT 2-3-4, that we couldn't kill at all, just because they had this ML lvl difference. So tell me why people with ML are redirected to IT 1-2-3 where the newbies are trying to play and they will face top players with insane gears and master level that they will just can't be able to kill. This is extremely unbalanced and it ruins the event, completely.

-At this point, when almost nobody has fenrir, DL can just leave a dust trail behind everyone else that tries to hunt goldens, because of his Horse he can reach the goldens before any other class, he can cover the maps before any other class.

-I saw several times DL's that can steal Cursed, Kundun, Bloody Queen, goldens, from top AE's like HellDrake, Senpai, Dajbuzi. The reason is, in PVP invasions or the boss events, DL's can just resist till the end, spamming Chaotic on the boss while AE's can instantly die and lose the opportunity for more dmg on the boss. On the other side, on NON-PVP, again, DL's have more DPS on chaotic, than AE's on MultiShot with perfect positioning. BETLEY as a DL can confirm you all that he easily stole, several times, bosses from AE's, in PVP and NON-PVP.

-And a lot of other things that you all noticed but you don't want to mention them because most of you now, changed into DL race so you can abuse it's overwhelming power over other classes. I can't wait for DL nerf so you can all change your races back, and be as bad as you were in the early stage. You were an MG at first eRoby, now you changed to DL, and we both know why. And I agree with you about VRF, he is extremely strong as well and easy to play, but has extremely low mobility and some of his spells are not hitting at all on moving targets, you need to have nerves of steel to play VRF against other classes.

[PVP view] Just a few small examples:

-Chaotic range and dps, it's insane. It's impossible for other classes to kite that since it has instant dmg on the target even if the target it's moving, not to mention the insane dps and dmg, even tho the DL is Hybryd DL and not pure SDL. It can just melt your health from a range that you can't even reach with other classes. And I will give you examples for each class, except SUMM, EMG and ARF, cause I haven't tested it my self:

[DL]vs[BK]: Except CC and IT, anywhere else BK has no chance against DL, especially because of it's horse power. DL can infinitely kite BK and spam chaotic from insane range, and why except CC and IT? Because outside this 2 events, DL can instant use Horse Power if the BK manages to reach his position. So between this classes, at this point, it's a "catch me if you can" game. While BK can't even get close to hit a combo, DL can just kite, run and spam Chaotic till BK dies. Not to mention the Destruction skill for BK, is it even working? I tried several times, can't hit a single slow on the target, either has way too low hit rate, either not working at all.

[DL]vs[SMG]: The same story as DL vs BK. The small difference is that SMG can use ice to slow DL down, but again, pointless, cause if SMG reaches DL position, he can easily use Horse Skill or antidotes. And let's not talk about a DL with 2 +4 Ring of Ice ^^

[DL]vs[AE]: While AE, as people mentioned above, has to sacrifice some points from her pure AGI build for Ice Arrow and lot of VIT to have decent health, not to insta die from 1 single hit, DL doesn't even have to balance a build, it works either way, you can't even tell the difference between a Hybryd DL and SDL, they both have insane survivability, insane mobility, insane health, insane dmg, insane def, you name it. AE has to get extremely close to DL to even try to use Ice Arrow on him. DL against AE, doesn't even have to move anyway so consider him permanently Iced but he can still kill you from insane range, while you as AE, can't get close to him to hit your full DMG, so what's the point? I know AE it's not supposed to be that good in PVP, but why you should limit the classes only for a small part of the game? So AE from now on it's gonna be useless in PVM and PVP as well? So everyone gonna just change race from now on? And we will see only elfs for Ice Arrow at CS and some bosses? Feels extremely wrong to me. There are people who wants to enjoy their favorite classes till the end of the game, not only for a small number of resets, then to just feel forced to change the class into something else that has potential in the game so they can compete with others. That's not fair to be honest, DL was a top class since the db started, could easily compete against AE with Chaotic. So why a class should permanently be top class in early, mid and maybe in late as well? But on the other hand, some classes will just be useless.

[DL]vs[SM]: As a SM my self, I can tell that at this point, SM it's the most balanced class in the game, the scaling it's exactly as the Staff said it will be. The SM is getting stronger and stronger as it should, in a balanced way, but again, we have a problem against DL. The key point of SM in PVP it will always be the positioning and your kiting skills so against other classes, SM can kite, position and fight back as it should be. But, against a DL, positioning and kiting with teleport, it's pointless. He can just use F10 outzoom to it's maximum and spam chaotic from a range that none of your spells can reach. SM was supposed to be a range class, right? Yet none of it's spells can reach a DL position while he can spam Chaotic from that position, as a SM not even when you try to use Ice Storm to the nearest position of that DL, sometimes it won't reach at all, but DL's chaotic will reach you. And if you will try to get in his range to spam Blast, you will instantly die.

[DL]vs[VRF]: At this point, VRF it's the only class that can get close to fight back a DL but even like that if only the DL stays still and it's not trying to kite. Imagine both 14rr classes(RF and DL). The ammount of health VRF has, it's huge, right? Arround 40k even more with full +hp set, rings. Well, imagine all that HP just going down like ice melting, from a range that VRF can't reach if the DL is kiting. Even tho the DL won't kite, VRF will have no chance against him.

[DL]vs[SUMM]: I haven't tested this one my self, feel free to speak if anyone did. But in my opinion, since SUMM is such a squishy class, we know the story

[DL]vs[EMG]: Not tested, but as SUMM class is, this EMG build it's squishy and as well, so the same story I guess.

[DL]vs[ARF]: Not tested, and since ARF it's trash in PVP, not even worth to mention.

[DL]vs[DL]: Not tested, but I am actually curious about a fight between SDL and Hybryd DL, i wanna see who wins.

I could go on with several examples, but you all know that DL is extremely broken at the moment, even tho some of you won't admit it, because you are defending your own class, but still. Even tho ADMIN said that DL it's still extremely strong, compared to other classes. Somehow, some of you are here telling us the opposite. At this point, even the worst DL player on the server, can beat most of other good players, just because the class it's broken and doesn't require too much skill, if not, doesn't require skill at all, since all you have to do it's to stay stil and spam Chaotic.

I hope it isn't too much to read, you can call me Reporter ^^. But I tried to put some things together since everyone is leaving their opinions here, there it is mine.

That's really nice post and i hope staff and council will take this into account when making any changes soon.

[Phantomel]

8 hours ago, enTaroaduN said:

I guess everyone is complaining about DL class, but not the DL owners themselves. Let me put it this way so you can understand, most of you on this server, changed race into DL, and why is that? Because you knew the class is way beyond broken, why? Let's see why:

[PVM view] Just a few small examples:

-As some people said above, about VRF solo stealing bc statue from AE's, I saw a lot of solo DL's stealing bc statues from solo AE's as well, using Chaotic. And as for a small example here, I tested my friend's pure AE with full Aruan Set, decent Albatros Bow Lk+2% +11, w2 +9, 13rr against Nephilim's DL. The thing was, indeed Nephilim is 14rr, not a big difference for 1 rr, but still, I managed to get first to 2 +5 goldens in Reliks, Nephilim came after 10 seconds or so. You know what was the result? He took both goldens, even tho I was first there, even tho I managed to have dmg advantage before him, he purely melted their healths with Chaotic like my elf was nothing.

-Illusion Temple event, the thing is, DL is invincible since now, he can rebuild before the event starts. He just goes full tank and the other 5 people can't kill him, we can just wait till he delivers the Star, again and again, not to mention his mobility while using Horse. So the DL's always be the first to reach the Star and take it. So who gets the DL in their team, it's 100% win. And as a small reference about IT(The Illusion Temple system that's extremely unbalanced and it's about Master Level. When the event starts, it gives you 131,141,151lvl and so on, well, the thing is, the ones who have Master LVL, will automatically be detected as more lvl than the others that don't have ML. I had several times people with ML in IT 2-3-4, that we couldn't kill at all, just because they had this ML lvl difference. So tell me why people with ML are redirected to IT 1-2-3 where the newbies are trying to play and they will face top players with insane gears and master level that they will just can't be able to kill. This is extremely unbalanced and it ruins the event, completely.

-At this point, when almost nobody has fenrir, DL can just leave a dust trail behind everyone else that tries to hunt goldens, because of his Horse he can reach the goldens before any other class, he can cover the maps before any other class.

-I saw several times DL's that can steal Cursed, Kundun, Bloody Queen, goldens, from top AE's like HellDrake, Senpai, Dajbuzi. The reason is, in PVP invasions or the boss events, DL's can just resist till the end, spamming Chaotic on the boss while AE's can instantly die and lose the opportunity for more dmg on the boss. On the other side, on NON-PVP, again, DL's have more DPS on chaotic, than AE's on MultiShot with perfect positioning. BETLEY as a DL can confirm you all that he easily stole, several times, bosses from AE's, in PVP and NON-PVP.

-And a lot of other things that you all noticed but you don't want to mention them because most of you now, changed into DL race so you can abuse it's overwhelming power over other classes. I can't wait for DL nerf so you can all change your races back, and be as bad as you were in the early stage. You were an MG at first eRoby, now you changed to DL, and we both know why. And I agree with you about VRF, he is extremely strong as well and easy to play, but has extremely low mobility and some of his spells are not hitting at all on moving targets, you need to have nerves of steel to play VRF against other classes.

[PVP view] Just a few small examples:

-Chaotic range and dps, it's insane. It's impossible for other classes to kite that since it has instant dmg on the target even if the target it's moving, not to mention the insane dps and dmg, even tho the DL is Hybryd DL and not pure SDL. It can just melt your health from a range that you can't even reach with other classes. And I will give you examples for each class, except SUMM, EMG and ARF, cause I haven't tested it my self:

[DL]vs[BK]: Except CC and IT, anywhere else BK has no chance against DL, especially because of it's horse power. DL can infinitely kite BK and spam chaotic from insane range, and why except CC and IT? Because outside this 2 events, DL can instant use Horse Power if the BK manages to reach his position. So between this classes, at this point, it's a "catch me if you can" game. While BK can't even get close to hit a combo, DL can just kite, run and spam Chaotic till BK dies. Not to mention the Destruction skill for BK, is it even working? I tried several times, can't hit a single slow on the target, either has way too low hit rate, either not working at all.

[DL]vs[SMG]: The same story as DL vs BK. The small difference is that SMG can use ice to slow DL down, but again, pointless, cause if SMG reaches DL position, he can easily use Horse Skill or antidotes. And let's not talk about a DL with 2 +4 Ring of Ice ^^

[DL]vs[AE]: While AE, as people mentioned above, has to sacrifice some points from her pure AGI build for Ice Arrow and lot of VIT to have decent health, not to insta die from 1 single hit, DL doesn't even have to balance a build, it works either way, you can't even tell the difference between a Hybryd DL and SDL, they both have insane survivability, insane mobility, insane health, insane dmg, insane def, you name it. AE has to get extremely close to DL to even try to use Ice Arrow on him. DL against AE, doesn't even have to move anyway so consider him permanently Iced but he can still kill you from insane range, while you as AE, can't get close to him to hit your full DMG, so what's the point? I know AE it's not supposed to be that good in PVP, but why you should limit the classes only for a small part of the game? So AE from now on it's gonna be useless in PVM and PVP as well? So everyone gonna just change race from now on? And we will see only elfs for Ice Arrow at CS and some bosses? Feels extremely wrong to me. There are people who wants to enjoy their favorite classes till the end of the game, not only for a small number of resets, then to just feel forced to change the class into something else that has potential in the game so they can compete with others. That's not fair to be honest, DL was a top class since the db started, could easily compete against AE with Chaotic. So why a class should permanently be top class in early, mid and maybe in late as well? But on the other hand, some classes will just be useless.

[DL]vs[SM]: As a SM my self, I can tell that at this point, SM it's the most balanced class in the game, the scaling it's exactly as the Staff said it will be. The SM is getting stronger and stronger as it should, in a balanced way, but again, we have a problem against DL. The key point of SM in PVP it will always be the positioning and your kiting skills so against other classes, SM can kite, position and fight back as it should be. But, against a DL, positioning and kiting with teleport, it's pointless. He can just use F10 outzoom to it's maximum and spam chaotic from a range that none of your spells can reach. SM was supposed to be a range class, right? Yet none of it's spells can reach a DL position while he can spam Chaotic from that position, as a SM not even when you try to use Ice Storm to the nearest position of that DL, sometimes it won't reach at all, but DL's chaotic will reach you. And if you will try to get in his range to spam Blast, you will instantly die.

[DL]vs[VRF]: At this point, VRF it's the only class that can get close to fight back a DL but even like that if only the DL stays still and it's not trying to kite. Imagine both 14rr classes(RF and DL). The ammount of health VRF has, it's huge, right? Arround 40k even more with full +hp set, rings. Well, imagine all that HP just going down like ice melting, from a range that VRF can't reach if the DL is kiting. Even tho the DL won't kite, VRF will have no chance against him.

[DL]vs[SUMM]: I haven't tested this one my self, feel free to speak if anyone did. But in my opinion, since SUMM is such a squishy class, we know the story

[DL]vs[EMG]: Not tested, but as SUMM class is, this EMG build it's squishy and as well, so the same story I guess.

[DL]vs[ARF]: Not tested, and since ARF it's trash in PVP, not even worth to mention.

[DL]vs[DL]: Not tested, but I am actually curious about a fight between SDL and Hybryd DL, i wanna see who wins.

I could go on with several examples, but you all know that DL is extremely broken at the moment, even tho some of you won't admit it, because you are defending your own class, but still. Even tho ADMIN said that DL it's still extremely strong, compared to other classes. Somehow, some of you are here telling us the opposite. At this point, even the worst DL player on the server, can beat most of other good players, just because the class it's broken and doesn't require too much skill, if not, doesn't require skill at all, since all you have to do it's to stay stil and spam Chaotic.

I hope it isn't too much to read, you can call me Reporter ^^. But I tried to put some things together since everyone is leaving their opinions here, there it is mine.

Let's not even mention that, if by a miracle, SMG and BK get in the range of DL with full hp/sd, they will still get insta melted, even if you hit your combos flawlessly, you dont stand a chance. Just a clear example - Me with full +12ddhp ashcrow set, decent weapons, balanced stats(or at least that's what I tend to think about them) got melted against a DL with +0 scale set, with only one DD piece and non exc scepter. Did like 4 combos and I dropped dead. No one can tell me this is balanced. 

[Roby]

9 hours ago, enTaroaduN said:

I guess everyone is complaining about DL class, but not the DL owners themselves. Let me put it this way so you can understand, most of you on this server, changed race into DL, and why is that? Because you knew the class is way beyond broken, why? Let's see why:

[PVM view] Just a few small examples:

-As some people said above, about VRF solo stealing bc statue from AE's, I saw a lot of solo DL's stealing bc statues from solo AE's as well, using Chaotic. And as for a small example here, I tested my friend's pure AE with full Aruan Set, decent Albatros Bow Lk+2% +11, w2 +9, 13rr against Nephilim's DL. The thing was, indeed Nephilim is 14rr, not a big difference for 1 rr, but still, I managed to get first to 2 +5 goldens in Reliks, Nephilim came after 10 seconds or so. You know what was the result? He took both goldens, even tho I was first there, even tho I managed to have dmg advantage before him, he purely melted their healths with Chaotic like my elf was nothing.

-Illusion Temple event, the thing is, DL is invincible since now, he can rebuild before the event starts. He just goes full tank and the other 5 people can't kill him, we can just wait till he delivers the Star, again and again, not to mention his mobility while using Horse. So the DL's always be the first to reach the Star and take it. So who gets the DL in their team, it's 100% win. And as a small reference about IT(The Illusion Temple system that's extremely unbalanced and it's about Master Level. When the event starts, it gives you 131,141,151lvl and so on, well, the thing is, the ones who have Master LVL, will automatically be detected as more lvl than the others that don't have ML. I had several times people with ML in IT 2-3-4, that we couldn't kill at all, just because they had this ML lvl difference. So tell me why people with ML are redirected to IT 1-2-3 where the newbies are trying to play and they will face top players with insane gears and master level that they will just can't be able to kill. This is extremely unbalanced and it ruins the event, completely.

-At this point, when almost nobody has fenrir, DL can just leave a dust trail behind everyone else that tries to hunt goldens, because of his Horse he can reach the goldens before any other class, he can cover the maps before any other class.

-I saw several times DL's that can steal Cursed, Kundun, Bloody Queen, goldens, from top AE's like HellDrake, Senpai, Dajbuzi. The reason is, in PVP invasions or the boss events, DL's can just resist till the end, spamming Chaotic on the boss while AE's can instantly die and lose the opportunity for more dmg on the boss. On the other side, on NON-PVP, again, DL's have more DPS on chaotic, than AE's on MultiShot with perfect positioning. BETLEY as a DL can confirm you all that he easily stole, several times, bosses from AE's, in PVP and NON-PVP.

-And a lot of other things that you all noticed but you don't want to mention them because most of you now, changed into DL race so you can abuse it's overwhelming power over other classes. I can't wait for DL nerf so you can all change your races back, and be as bad as you were in the early stage. You were an MG at first eRoby, now you changed to DL, and we both know why. And I agree with you about VRF, he is extremely strong as well and easy to play, but has extremely low mobility and some of his spells are not hitting at all on moving targets, you need to have nerves of steel to play VRF against other classes.

[PVP view] Just a few small examples:

-Chaotic range and dps, it's insane. It's impossible for other classes to kite that since it has instant dmg on the target even if the target it's moving, not to mention the insane dps and dmg, even tho the DL is Hybryd DL and not pure SDL. It can just melt your health from a range that you can't even reach with other classes. And I will give you examples for each class, except SUMM, EMG and ARF, cause I haven't tested it my self:

[DL]vs[BK]: Except CC and IT, anywhere else BK has no chance against DL, especially because of it's horse power. DL can infinitely kite BK and spam chaotic from insane range, and why except CC and IT? Because outside this 2 events, DL can instant use Horse Power if the BK manages to reach his position. So between this classes, at this point, it's a "catch me if you can" game. While BK can't even get close to hit a combo, DL can just kite, run and spam Chaotic till BK dies. Not to mention the Destruction skill for BK, is it even working? I tried several times, can't hit a single slow on the target, either has way too low hit rate, either not working at all.

[DL]vs[SMG]: The same story as DL vs BK. The small difference is that SMG can use ice to slow DL down, but again, pointless, cause if SMG reaches DL position, he can easily use Horse Skill or antidotes. And let's not talk about a DL with 2 +4 Ring of Ice ^^

[DL]vs[AE]: While AE, as people mentioned above, has to sacrifice some points from her pure AGI build for Ice Arrow and lot of VIT to have decent health, not to insta die from 1 single hit, DL doesn't even have to balance a build, it works either way, you can't even tell the difference between a Hybryd DL and SDL, they both have insane survivability, insane mobility, insane health, insane dmg, insane def, you name it. AE has to get extremely close to DL to even try to use Ice Arrow on him. DL against AE, doesn't even have to move anyway so consider him permanently Iced but he can still kill you from insane range, while you as AE, can't get close to him to hit your full DMG, so what's the point? I know AE it's not supposed to be that good in PVP, but why you should limit the classes only for a small part of the game? So AE from now on it's gonna be useless in PVM and PVP as well? So everyone gonna just change race from now on? And we will see only elfs for Ice Arrow at CS and some bosses? Feels extremely wrong to me. There are people who wants to enjoy their favorite classes till the end of the game, not only for a small number of resets, then to just feel forced to change the class into something else that has potential in the game so they can compete with others. That's not fair to be honest, DL was a top class since the db started, could easily compete against AE with Chaotic. So why a class should permanently be top class in early, mid and maybe in late as well? But on the other hand, some classes will just be useless.

[DL]vs[SM]: As a SM my self, I can tell that at this point, SM it's the most balanced class in the game, the scaling it's exactly as the Staff said it will be. The SM is getting stronger and stronger as it should, in a balanced way, but again, we have a problem against DL. The key point of SM in PVP it will always be the positioning and your kiting skills so against other classes, SM can kite, position and fight back as it should be. But, against a DL, positioning and kiting with teleport, it's pointless. He can just use F10 outzoom to it's maximum and spam chaotic from a range that none of your spells can reach. SM was supposed to be a range class, right? Yet none of it's spells can reach a DL position while he can spam Chaotic from that position, as a SM not even when you try to use Ice Storm to the nearest position of that DL, sometimes it won't reach at all, but DL's chaotic will reach you. And if you will try to get in his range to spam Blast, you will instantly die.

[DL]vs[VRF]: At this point, VRF it's the only class that can get close to fight back a DL but even like that if only the DL stays still and it's not trying to kite. Imagine both 14rr classes(RF and DL). The ammount of health VRF has, it's huge, right? Arround 40k even more with full +hp set, rings. Well, imagine all that HP just going down like ice melting, from a range that VRF can't reach if the DL is kiting. Even tho the DL won't kite, VRF will have no chance against him.

[DL]vs[SUMM]: I haven't tested this one my self, feel free to speak if anyone did. But in my opinion, since SUMM is such a squishy class, we know the story

[DL]vs[EMG]: Not tested, but as SUMM class is, this EMG build it's squishy and as well, so the same story I guess.

[DL]vs[ARF]: Not tested, and since ARF it's trash in PVP, not even worth to mention.

[DL]vs[DL]: Not tested, but I am actually curious about a fight between SDL and Hybryd DL, i wanna see who wins.

I could go on with several examples, but you all know that DL is extremely broken at the moment, even tho some of you won't admit it, because you are defending your own class, but still. Even tho ADMIN said that DL it's still extremely strong, compared to other classes. Somehow, some of you are here telling us the opposite. At this point, even the worst DL player on the server, can beat most of other good players, just because the class it's broken and doesn't require too much skill, if not, doesn't require skill at all, since all you have to do it's to stay stil and spam Chaotic.

I hope it isn't too much to read, you can call me Reporter ^^. But I tried to put some things together since everyone is leaving their opinions here, there it is mine.

Ok i really tried to read ... But i stopped here
-''At this point, when almost nobody has fenrir, DL can just leave a dust trail behind everyone else that tries to hunt goldens, because of his Horse he can reach the goldens before any other class, he can cover the maps before any other class.''

It s just so desperate and cringe to say that lol , hey let s remove the dark horse from dark  lord .

Second attempt to read

''VRF has no chance vs DL '' idk what server you play my man , but DL no longer beats RF no matter how much he kites .

I m seeing your stats right now , you are 12 rr and equiped with acc set + 0 , and probably u have 2 k max vit , and u come to complain of pvp settings .